Emergency Rudder Ideas

[tboussie]

I know that this is a topic well covered in various corners of the SSS websphere, so forgive me if I am covering old ground.

I am prepping my boat (Capo 30: 30', 7500 lb displacement) for the 2017 LongPac and hopefully for the 2018 SSS Transpac. High on my long list of boat upgrades is installation of an emergency rudder system. As I see it, my options break roughly into the following:
1) Buy a complete system from a commercial fabricator
2) Work with / buy a system from a local non-commercial individual who knows what they are doing
3) Fabricate myself
4) Buy or rent a suitable system from a local sailor

For option 1), I have solicited several quotes and they have come in roughly 1/3 the entire value of my boat. This does not seem like a good fit for a poor bastard / skinflint like myself.

Option 2) is attractive, but I do not know anyone who fits this description. Suggestions welcome.

Option 3) is also attractive, but given my experience (none) in fabricating complex laminate and high-load structural materials for safety-critical systems, I frankly don't trust myself. Perhaps in combination with option 2)?

Option 4) is the most attractive of all. Surely there are boats out there similar to mine that have done the Transpac or PacCup in years past and whose emergency rudders are sitting in their garages. I would be interested in buying, or better yet renting their E-rudders (similar to renting a liferaft). They challenge is finding those boats and making contact with those skippers. Any specific leads for my boat would be welcome, along with any general ideas for facilitating the efficient re-use of the pool of E-rudders in the garages of our fellow sailors.

 

[Daydreamer]

My plan is option 3

I plan to fabricate a foil and cassette along with a track to accommodate the cassette or the outboard bracket.

I have most of the stainless and will order core material and carbon fiber soon.

"FiberGlast" seems to have competitive pricing. Any other suggestions?

For option 2, I believe solosailor has built a few cassette systems for SSSers.

 

[svShearwater]

Have you priced CCI Composites in Canada? They built ours. It's fabulous. We could keep racing with it and with the Canadian exchange rate it won't be 1/3rd the cost of your boat.

 

[Ian Rogers]

E-rudders can be an expansive proposition. On the Moore 24 for the DH Pac Cup we used a rudder made by Gilles at GC Marine in Pt Richmond. I know the costs are higher than other vendors, but his rudders have been tested and proven to work. The construction is all carbon fiber and he was able to make the e-rudder tiller double as a spare tiller for our stock rudder.

 

[CRC1965]

If you are going to fabricate it yourself....please do some of the engineering calculations or have someone help you to make sure what you build is going to hold up to sail what may be 1,000 plus miles. Also, do make sure the system will allow deployment in an unpleasant sea state. I did what Ian did above....the cost is high, once you see what goes into the design and manufacture you start to understand why. Obviously if you have the engineering background, composite skills and time...it should be a fun project.
Chris (Ventus)

 

[tboussie]

Gilles at GC Marine

E-rudders can be an expansive proposition. On the Moore 24 for the DH Pac Cup we used a rudder made by Gilles at GC Marine in Pt Richmond. I know the costs are higher than other vendors, but his rudders have been tested and proven to work. The construction is all carbon fiber and he was able to make the e-rudder tiller double as a spare tiller for our stock rudder.

I contacted Gilles about an E-rudder quote. He has been very responsive and I am confident that he does excellent work. Unfortunately, the quote was in the "1/3 the value of my boat" range. I completely understand how a one-off custom E-rudder is inherently expensive to fabricate. I will go there if I have to, but in the meantime I am exploring all other options. I continue to hold out hope that I can locate a suitable rudder for sale/rent from a previous Pac Cup, Transpac, or SH Transpac boat.

 

[CRC1965]

I wish you good luck finding something suitable. It is painful to shell out that much money for something you don't use. More sails would be easier to justify.
C

 

[AZ Sailor]

The line drawings on Sailboatdata.com for the Capo 30 and Capri 30 look similar, and dimensions don't look too different, or so it seems to ignorant me. Barry Bristol did the 2016 SHTP in a Capri 30, and someone told me the other day he won't do another. Maybe his e-rud gear is available for sale or rent.

 

[SeanRhone]

I contacted Gilles about an E-rudder quote. He has been very responsive and I am confident that he does excellent work. Unfortunately, the quote was in the "1/3 the value of my boat" range. I completely understand how a one-off custom E-rudder is inherently expensive to fabricate. I will go there if I have to, but in the meantime I am exploring all other options. I continue to hold out hope that I can locate a suitable rudder for sale/rent from a previous Pac Cup, Transpac, or SH Transpac boat.

Can I ask what the quote amount was? I'm in the same position of needing a e-rudder and would love the information.

 

[AlanH]

I made an emergency rudder for my Santana 3030 from closed cell foam and a mess of 'glass. It was terribly oversized, insanely heavy but it did steer the boat. I sold it to a couple of guys who were taking a 50-footer to Hawaii in the Pac Cup.

In 2007 I made a foam core rudder from a NACA 0015 blank from Flying Foam - https://flyingfoam.com/

I'm no whizbang composite dude, so I just put on layer of knytex - http://www.tapplastics.com/product/fiberglass/carbon_specialty_fabrics/knytex_x_mat/91 in TAP medium-set marine epoxy and then a layer of unidirectional glass cloth over the top of that, oriented vertically along the rudder blade. I didn't vacuum it, I just laid out a mess of sandbags on the garage floor, wrapped the whole thing in wax paper.....that's right, wax paper.... and then put more sandbags on top. A day and half later I took it all apart. If I was doing it again, I'd use actual peel ply instead of wax paper. That would save a LOT of sanding.

The thing was pretty heavy, a lot heavier than a foam/epoxy/carbon, vacuum-bagged rudder, but I could stand on it and sort-of jump up and down on it, so I figured it was pretty strong. It also cost 1/8th of what a custom rudder would cost. The blade wasn't *THAT* much work, but the cassette was a PITA. I made the cassette from wood and sections of door skins. Door skins will bend, with patience and encouragement. The skins were glued/screwed in the front to a shaped piece of 2 x 4. Three layers were epoxied together to make a 3/8ths inch cassette. In the back they were glassed over with mutliple layers of tape. Then I wrapped the thing with a few winds of unidirectional carbon in epoxy, just where the gudgeons were going to go. My welding dude in Redwood City made some custom gudgeons for me. They got attached and voila.

This isn't my cassette, mine swept back to a "V" shape at the back, but you get the idea. It was basically like this, adding in the carbon fiber straps. This picture is from Kame Richards site.

http://www.sailmaker.com/articles/e_rudder/images/er_cas1.jpg

I tested it in the Bay, sailing from Coyote Point to Berkeley and back again with the main rudder tied off and just using the emergency rudder. It loaded up a lot and sure it wasn't as fair as a pro-job but it worked.

Honest truth is that my next emergency rudder will be purchased from Rudder Craft.
https://ruddercraft.com/

They make a NACA 0012 section, milled polyethylene rudder that will sit just fine on the back end of my boat. It's sized for something like a Catalina 25, and the price is great. It will, however, require patience to deploy as it doesn't come with a cassette.

https://ruddercraft.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=164_32&product_id=98

 

[SeanRhone]

SHTP Inspectors - Does using a Galerider drogue rigged like in the video meet the e-rudder requirements for the SHTP?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vupIl68mCYg

 

[sleddog]

SHTP Inspectors - Does using a Galerider drogue rigged like in the video meet the e-rudder requirements for the SHTP?

Not an inspector. Each boat and situation different. Up to the skipper to test and prove his emergency steering, not the inspector. As mentioned before, drogue may get a boat downwind to Hawaii. But never in time for the bronze belt buckle. And likely run out of food and water before anchor down. Best an active emergency steering system. My 2 cents.

 

[SeanRhone]

I'm looking for an e-rudder that I don't have to put hole in my boat to install. I don't want/have $3k+ to buy a e-rudder system and I'm not "handy" enough to build a suitable system myself. I also don't want to 1/2 a$$ it and have some 2x4 with a paddle system which really won't do the job.

What do you mean by an "active emergency steering"?

 

[sleddog]

I encourage anyone going offshore to carry a drogue ...Galerider is good, car tire or milk crate does same thing. If you are satisfied with emergency steering using a drogue, I assume an SHTP inspector will also be. Unlikely he will call for a demonstration. That's up to you.

That said, a reference to the video cited begs the question: why was the demonstration done in smooth water, under power, with no wind? More realistic is to sail offshore in a seaway and see what ya got. Like running back from 1/2 way to the Farallones in 20 knots. Let us know how it works, and a video would be good also.

 

[The Smokester]

You can buy an m-rud emergency rudder from Scanmar for less.

http://www.selfsteer.com/products/monitor/mrud.php

 

[AlanH]

I'm looking for an e-rudder that I don't have to put hole in my boat to install. I don't want/have $3k+ to buy a e-rudder system and I'm not "handy" enough to build a suitable system myself. I also don't want to 1/2 a$$ it and have some 2x4 with a paddle system which really won't do the job.

What do you mean by an "active emergency steering"?

SeanRhone, an e-rudder doesn't have to be a hugely complicated composite structure. You can make a wood one. I'll outline the process for a smaller boat where you can mount the rudder a little off-center on a transom. If you have a reverse transom then look up pictures of Synthia Petroka's "Eyrie" when she did her TransPac. Look at the bracket/board thingy on the back end. You'll need a way to set that up. That's what I did.

Anyway, the rudder.

You'll want some gudgeons and pintles. For a boat that's 22-27 feet, you'll want gudgeons and pintles that use a half-inch pin. That's what a J-24 uses. I'd recommend looking here-

http://www.duckworksbbs.com/hardware/p-g/rl890/index.htm

If I had a 22-24 footer I'd probably buy those bits, right there in that page I just linked to. If I had a bigger boat (like mine) I'd probably look around for hardware build a bit stronger, but still used a half-inch pin. West Marine sells some beefy stuff by Shaeffer. It's pricey, but it's beef. It need to be "drop in"....you just "drop' the rudder onto the fittings. What you DON'T want is a "line-up" setup like this.

While it's undoubtably stronger, lining up all that stuff, while hanging off the back end of the boat is going to be a PITA, and may not even be possible. "Drop-in" is tough enough. I've done it...it takes patience and care and time, but it's doable..

OK, look at your pintles. They're going to accomodate a rudder of a particular thickness, probably 1.5 or 1.75 inches. Well, plain old lumberyard douglas fir 2 x 4's or 2 x 6's are 1.75 inches thick. So go down to the lumberyard and buy some 2 x 6's or even 2 x 2's. Now, rip the 2 x 6's into 6 foot long 2 x 2 squares (which will really be 1.75 x 1.75). When you have six or seven of these, then mix-and-match 'em...turn a few upside-down, shuffle 'em up so that no piece of wood is lying exactly next to another piece originally from the same board. Then glue 'em together with epoxy like this.

 

[AlanH]

If you're into it, go look up NACA foil sections online. Modern rudders are often made in an airfoil shape that conforms pretty closely to the NACA 0012 foil. Some boats use NACA 0015. Here's a NACA 0015 foil.

You can print that, then use your computer to blow it up until the front-to-back length is the same as the front-to-back length (called the Chord) of your rudder. I mean, print that out...just half of it, just one side... and transfer it to a piece of plywood or plastic and use that to help you shape your rudder. An NACA 0012 foil is skinnier than a NACA 0015 foil, so maybe NACA 0012 will work better with your 2 x 2 laminated rudder.


However......
Honestly, it's a freaking emergency rudder. Does it REALLY have to be an exact NACA foil? Instead, how about you seriously round off the front and then taper the back 2/3's to a reasonable straight line in the back that's about 1/4 inch thick? A hand-held power planer (used, about $50 on Craigslist) will do this job in about 4 hours. Make it as close to that NACA foil as you can but don't sweat the EXACTNESS of it all. Now sand the snot out of that "foil". Make it really smooth down to at least 100 grit sandpaper. You're going to do this to the bottom 3 1/2 feet (depending on your boat) of your rudder. The top you leave rectangular, 'cause it's not in the water.

I'd suggest cutting back the top of the rectangular part of the rudder about the equivalent of one 2 x 2 board. Look at the rudder on the right, here. On the RIGHT. Figure out which edge of the rudder is the leading edge and which is the trailing edge. See how the upper part is cut back? Just cut that back about 2 inches, not more than that. This will make the rudder loads easier to steer.

You don't have to do this, but you can trim off some of the top of the rudder to save weight. I'm going to suggest that you drill a half-inch hole clean through the top of the rudder, in the rectangular part, maybe 6-8 inches down from the top. If you have to deploy it, a safety line will go through this, and get tied to a strong point on the boat, so that if you drop it while deploying it, you won't lose it.

OK, now paint the whole rudder with epoxy. Let it soak in really good. Sand. Paint again. Sand. Paint with an epoxy-based paint of whatever color turns you on.

Now, install your pintles so that they fit with the spacing of the gudgeons on the back of the boat..

Voila, emergency rudder.

 

[AlanH]

You'll need a tiller for your emergency rudder, huh? I'd suggest not over-thinking this.

It just has to be very strong. You know, the rudder doesn't HAVE to be able to swing up and down. What law says that it HAS to have straps that go on both sides of the rudder? You could literally just bolt a length of 2 x 2 to the side of the rudder head, right? If you plan ahead you might be able to set it up so that your autopilot can still run it.

Finally, people think that tillers HAVE to face forward in the boat. They do not. A "bee stinger" tiller arm that sticks out the BACK, and is controlled by lines and blocks works just fine. You can run those lines to a wheel or to another tiller mounted in the cockpit....say if there's a six-foot lazarette at the back of your boat. Set up lines/blocks on the stern cleats, or if your spinnaker pole is longer than the transom is wide, then use that to increase your angle/leverage. That's exactly how my emergency tiller worked on my SC27.

 

[AlanH]

I love all the incredible composite e-rudders and cassettes that I keep seeing and man I'd love one, too. It's tough to justify dropping $2k on a system like that.

But I know that I can build a strong, reasonably-performing low-tech system that will work with my tiller pilot, for about 25% of that. It just takes some time.

Finally, another option is to just watch e-bay until a rudder comes up for sale.

Like this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Catalina-25...ash=item3d29ad544f:g:WUYAAOSw44BYEM4B&vxp=mtr

Hell, if I was heading for Hawaii in 2018, I'd buy that thing right now. $359 plus shipping? The gudgeons to mount that will cost me about $70.

I'd get the gudgeons and mount them to a piece of 2 x 4 or 2 x 6. Then I'd go down to Allan Steel and get some brackets made so I could "swing down" that board, with the rudder attached to it. Bolt those brackets to the boat...DONE.... for probably <$500.

 

[tboussie]

E-Rudder Update

The line drawings on Sailboatdata.com for the Capo 30 and Capri 30 look similar, and dimensions don't look too different, or so it seems to ignorant me. Barry Bristol did the 2016 SHTP in a Capri 30, and someone told me the other day he won't do another. Maybe his e-rud gear is available for sale or rent.

Thanks to AZ Sailor for the suggestion of contacting Barry Bristol regarding his E-rudder. Jackie got me Barry's e-mail address and we have exchanged several messages. It looks like it should work for my boat. I plan to drive down to Encinitas next month to check it out in person and hopefully take delivery.

BTW, I did get a quote from CCI Composites that came in at ~$2800 including shipping. I would have to add the cassette mounting hardware to that, bringing the total in >$3000. I was ready to go there, and still will if Barry's rudder does not work out.

Tom