Longpac RRC - prep

[dhusselman]

Reading through the RRC, most of it makes sense.
The one requirement I don't understand is:

4.42 A man overboard pole handy to the helmsman, and a properly installed Lifesling. The man overboard pole must be equipped with the following:
[a] horseshoe buoy
whistle
[c] strobe light
[d] sea anchor
[e] 12"x12" highly visible flag

Reminds me of the IOR days. This is a new requirement, unless I was never inspected on that item.
Is this appropriate for a single handed race?

 

[BobJ]

Dirk, a few of us discussed this last night including Ben and Lucie, the LongPac Race Chairs. I can't speak for them about what is required for LongPac but they are reviewing this item. I'd say if you plan to race LongPac singlehanded and haven't bought the items above - other than the Lifesling, which I think will be required for both SH and DH - you might wait for an answer from them before doing so.

A bit of "generic" background on this, posted here before: Under CG regulations, all boats (not just racers or even just sailboats) are required to have a Type IV (throwable) device available to the helm. Technically the LifeSling wouldn't meet this requirement because it's attached to the boat and is intended for a different purpose, but it has been CG approved as a "Type V which substitutes for a Type IV." A lot of boats carry a CG approved throwable cushion to meet the Type IV requirement. Larger boats and offshore boats usually have a (yellow) horseshoe and this, along with a whistle and self-igniting light, is what NorCalORC requires (without the pole, drogue and flag).

I'll add that the Type IV cushions I see are often white, but this makes them almost invisible once you throw them in the water.

Bottom line - Ben and Lucie are mulling over this requirement in response to your inquiry (and others).

 

[Tchoupitoulas]

There was also some discussion about the Danbuoy.

http://www.danbuoy.com/
http://www.landfallnavigation.com/sosdanbuoy.html

It seems to me like this would be a good replacement for both the MOB pole requirement for double-handers in the LongPac (Ben and Lucie seem to favor removing the requirement for single-handers) as well as the horseshoe, floating light and whistle that NorCalORC requires. Since Single-handed Farallones is using NorCal Minimum Offshore Requirements I would like to use the Danbuoy instead of the horseshoe, floating light and whistle. NorCalORC MORs specifically state that a "Man Overboard Module meets this requirement." I believe that is referring to a specific product from Switlik which we are all familiar with. The Danbuoy seemingly has the added benefit of being more readily accessible than a MOM on the pushpit. And rather than just drop off of the back of the boat, you can throw it to weather. I intend to ask NorCalORC if the Danbuoy will satisfy the requirement, but if (or when) I come in for my safety inspection after the Farallones Race, will the SSS RC accept the Danbuoy as meeting the NorCalORC MOR #25 requirement? I know SSS doesn't control the NorCalORC requirements so I am asking for an opinion. I would like to get a pre-inspection at which time I may receive an answer, but I am not sure I can arrange that in time.
By the way the MOM module is about $720 at Landfall Navigation and the Danbuoy is $325.
Thanks,
Stephen

Starbuck #8666

 

[BobJ]

Hi Stephen. I just got a reply from Andy Newell. He says yes, the SOS Dan Buoy would meet NorCalORC's requirement for item 25 "provided it's within its service/repack interval."

I watched the video on Landfall Nav's site and that looks like a great device for marking a MOB's location.

 

[Tchoupitoulas]

Thanks Bob. Since it is user-repackable I'm assuming it just has a reminder to check over and maybe replace the canister at a certain interval. Perhaps yearly?

 

[dhusselman]

Dirk, a few of us discussed this last night including Ben and Lucie, the LongPac Race Chairs. I can't speak for them about what is required for LongPac but they are reviewing this item. I'd say if you plan to race LongPac singlehanded and haven't bought the items above - other than the Lifesling, which I think will be required for both SH and DH - you might wait for an answer from them before doing so.

A bit of "generic" background on this, posted here before: Under CG regulations, all boats (not just racers or even just sailboats) are required to have a Type IV (throwable) device available to the helm. Technically the LifeSling wouldn't meet this requirement because it's attached to the boat and is intended for a different purpose, but it has been CG approved as a "Type V which substitutes for a Type IV." A lot of boats carry a CG approved throwable cushion to meet the Type IV requirement. Larger boats and offshore boats usually have a (yellow) horseshoe and this, along with a whistle and self-igniting light, is what NorCalORC requires (without the pole, drogue and flag).

I'll add that the Type IV cushions I see are often white, but this makes them almost invisible once you throw them in the water.

Bottom line - Ben and Lucie are mulling over this requirement in response to your inquiry (and others).

Thanks Bob,

Sorry I missed the meeting last week. I carry a LifeSling as well as a horseshoe with whistle and light. I will wait to hear about the pole verdict...

Dirk
Xpression - C&C 110

 

[knickspant]

Any equipment which meets 4.2 will fulfill the requirement is fine. It is required for both singlehanded and double handed entries.

The notion of excluding some equipment for singlehanded entries has been discussed repeatedly, as you'll find perusing Tinker's anthology of Ergo's posts over the seasons.

Lucie & Ben

 

[dhusselman]

Any equipment which meets 4.2 will fulfill the requirement is fine. It is required for both singlehanded and double handed entries.

The notion of excluding some equipment for singlehanded entries has been discussed repeatedly, as you'll find perusing Tinker's anthology of Ergo's posts over the seasons.

Lucie & Ben

Lucie & Ben,

Thanks for confirming the requirements. I'm not questioning equipment for single-handed vs, double-handed or crewed. I was surprised to see the "man overboard pole" as a requirement. I thought that was long gone...I could see it replaced with a mandatory PLB. Last time I had a man overboard pole was during the IOR days. So either it is reintroduced or I was "lucky" that it was not checked for during inspection.

Dirk - Xpression

 

[BobJ]

Here is the requirement from the 2011 LongPac RR&C's. It applied only to doublehanded entries:

"4.42 For doublehanded entries, a man overboard pole handy to the helmsman, and a
properly installed Lifesling. The man overboard pole must be equipped with the
following:
[a] horseshoe buoy
whistle
[c] strobe light
[d] sea anchor
[e] 12"x12" highly visible flag

When I used to carry all this for OYRA, it tended to come loose and get dragged behind the boat. For all boats including fully-crewed, NorCalORC has simplified it to a horsehoe with light and whistle, which is a lot easier to untie and throw quickly. I recognize we're not using NorCalORC rules for the LongPac - just pointing out the differences.

 

[Tchoupitoulas]

Any equipment which meets 4.2 will fulfill the requirement is fine. It is required for both singlehanded and double handed entries.

The notion of excluding some equipment for singlehanded entries has been discussed repeatedly, as you'll find perusing Tinker's anthology of Ergo's posts over the seasons.

Lucie & Ben

Well what else DOES fulfill the requirement? Danbuoy? MOM?

 

[tiger beetle]

Well what else DOES fulfill the requirement? Danbuoy? MOM?

I have a Switlik MOM8 unit - when deployed/released and inflated, it has:
a pylon/pole
strobe light (at least flashing, may not be a xenon strobe)
horseshoe flotation collar/ring
whistle
sea anchor

The MOM8 pole doesn't carry a 12"x12" flag, and I will argue the pole is large in diameter (as compared to a thin fiberglass MOB pole/wand) and is reasonably visible, and has retroflective tape at the top for locating at night; I'll argue that's as good as a flag.

The SOS Danbuoy has:
a drogue
a pole, with streamer/flag and retroflective tape
a light (doesn't say strobe light)

doesn't seem to have a strobe light or a horeshoe ring, instead substituting two straps to put your arms through such that you hug the floating pole. If I were an inspectior (which I'm not) I'd want to see one in use before accepting the pole alone in lieu of a horseshoe collar (my impression is that the danbuoy will require more arm strength to maintain flotation as compared to floating in a horseshoe collar - but not having used a danbuoy I do not know whether or not my premise is correct) . The lack of strobe is also an issue, if in fact there is no strobe (so you could tie a strobe light to the kit to meet the rule). You'd also need to attach a whistle to the danbuoy.

Or you could simply assemble what I used to carry before purchasing the MOM8:
a pole w/flag
a strobe light
horseshoe collar
drogue
whistle

At least those are my thoughts. The rule doesn't seem complicated or difficult to meet from my perspective, especially if you already have the basic MOB pole and horseshoe collar (which I always did) - just add a strobe, whistle, and drogue and you're good to go.

- rob/beetle

 

[knickspant]

Yes, Steve, the Danbuoy and MOM (horseshoe, whistle, strobe, highly visible flag, sea anchor) equals the equipment listed...doesn't it? And look, now it's on sale!

Lucie