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Around the World from West coast?

Another update ... I've heard again that there may be a Class40 round the world race. There may be official developments in 6-9 months. I'm going to wait things out and won't look for a boat now. Or more specifically I'm going to focus on finding a used Pogo 40S3 that I can afford.

I'm also going to try to find ways to race on these boats. There's in fact a boat available for charter for the Transat Jacques Vabre 2019, for $40,000. Would anyone be interested?

Still looking for a dinghy too ...
 
I reached out to a few Class40 owners who have put their boat up for charter. So far I've only exchanged info with one guy. In short it'd be about €100,000 minimum as he wants €60,000 just for the boat (for the whole season). So that's out.
I need to call another guy who wants to talk; his advertised price seemed more within reach.

I think I may still just get myself a good old boat and carry on with the initial plan. I'm considering Santa Cruz 40, Olson 40, older Pogo 40. Any other suggestions?
 
Another thought would be a J/35. Fast and sea-kindly. Headroom is only 6-1, I think. Someone started out from the East Coast in the late 80's to go around the world, but fell asleep and ended up on. a reef on Bermuda. Plenty around for between 20 and 40k, and shouldn't be too hard to fit with water ballast and w.t. bulkheads. There is also the Express 37, but I don't know if it's up to the task. Hard to believe the Olson 40 would be up for it.

Out of your price range and on the wrong coast, but this looks like a good deal for someone who wants to truck across oceans: https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1994/custom-ketch-mix-55-2714805/

This one could be a steal or a nightmare: https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2000/j-boats-j46-3489782/
 
I looked at the Freya 39 in Brisbane. Pictures here:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/EHp246Y78aDaimAD9
I can't say it's in good shape. It's possible it's mostly cosmetics but ...
I may also check the one in Morro Bay tomorrow.
I discussed boat speed with the owner of that boat. My guess is for half of the trip I'll be running. At 10 kts of wind I'd be doing 4.5kts. At 15 maybe 7-8 kts.
One thing I'm not sure I like is all the stuff in the boat. I liked with Double Espresso that I could see the hull. With the Freya 39 you can't even get to the bilge, as it's at the bottom of the keel, where a sump pump is working.
 
That's a whole bunch of work! As I understand it some Freyas were not factory finshed and this appears to be one. I especially like the empty rum bottle behind the latest project. Curious to see what you find out in Morro Bay. Definitely a trade off having flooring and extra cabinetry hiding the hull but then consider nights like tonight and ask yourself fin or full keel?
Thanks for the update.
 
And, after a long drive in the rain and wind, the Freya 39 in Morro Bay, in better shape: https://photos.app.goo.gl/RTBccQiCNFsxsWtQA
Still everything is old.

I think I've identified what is bugging me about these "good old boats": it's all the stuff inside. I think I would go nuts stuck in 5 kts of wind seeing all that woodwork inside and would throw it out in anger :-) Remember, I threw my water away on the way to Hawaii when I was too slow ... Well, not everything, and I still had almost 10 gallons when I made landfall. The thing that stuck with me towards the end of the trip to Hanalei Bay is that, even though I tried to bring as little as possible, I thought there was just too much stuff around. Maybe it would bug me less if it was not in plain sight, like in cabinets. Oh, wait ...

The owner today made a comment about his boat being fast in light wind and I asked him to clarify. He said he was doing 4.5 kts in 5 kts of wind, that doesn't seem right now that I put this in writing; so let's say it was apparent wind. Anyways, the fun part was that he said he did this by having his spinnaker to leeward (read: pole to leeward), genoa out to windward, and 3 reefs in the main, centered, or something like that: https://goo.gl/images/Lt1nqW

Maybe I should find a Freya 39, Fast Passage 39, Valiant 40 that's been gutted, put a couple hammocks in and go ... A Fast Passage 39 finished the BOC 82-83 in 209 days, the course was 27,100 nm, and the average speed on course was 5.40 kts. That is is a real life value I can use for planning.That's probably more days at sea than I was hoping for. On a similar course the Open 40 Spirit of Yukoh took 180 days, for an avg spd on course of 6.27.

I wonder if these 3 boat designs have been compared for performance in real life. Who wins? 0.1 kts means a lot on such a long route.
 
Philippe, Have you considered this one?

39-FT WYLIE MASTHEAD SLOOP, 1984
Richmond Yacht Club $20,000-asking/obo
'Marishanna'. Wylie 39 with gaudy racing record, Day-sailing layout. Comes with full offshore kit. Built by Westerly Marine. Sweet sailing masthead sloop.
(415) 383-0949
 
So I don't plan to sail around the world, but I can still think about what boat I might select. I think Dazzler's suggestion deserves a close look; Tom designs good boats and Westerly built good ones. The Fairweather 39 down south, too. I would forget old cruiser/racers because, well, they're old. And used. And probably passed through owners who haven't kept them up, kept their equipment current, and frankly mistreated them. Too much work, too much that could go wrong. Too much like the current batch of singlehanded rounders whose old boats are failing them.

If I were serious about a circumnavigation I'd have to decide between speed and comfort. Speed would mean looking at boats more race dedicated than cruise oriented. If I wanted to sail on the edge and had the bucks, I'd be looking at recent ocean racing veterans and be prepared for minimum comfort (no teak). If I just wanted to "sail around the world" in a reasonable amount of time I'd look at the two boats above for starters. And several others that have been suggested.
 
Speed vs comfort: speed. My SHTP and experiences with Clipper set the standard for comfort so there's no need to sweeten the deal there.

About the Wylie 39 ... it's not the first to come on my radar, the 3rd in fact. I think each boat was built to different standards, based on my conversation with Tom Wylie. He thought the boat was not strong enough, nor had enough ballast. Would this Wylie 39 Marishanna be of a strong built, i.e. it was put together for offshoring, breaking waves, knock downs, capsizes, etc.?
 
I just played with OpenCPN again to figure out distance. It looks like rounding a buoy off Argentina's Bahia Bianca can give me 21,760 miles (which looks like what other westbound RTW use at the WSSRC). Then looking at Windy.tv and trying to line up a route with the trades I'm down for 26,000 miles. At the 5.4 kts average that's 200 days.

Also I've been checking windy.tv here and there for the past months. Mostly I'll be sailing downwind in 10-15 kts. The key exception would be rounding the Horn. So then should I find a boat that performs well in the conditions I'll have 80% of the time, or one that will be comfortable for 5% of the time? Do we have a case of "The Oak and the reed"? I keep thinking about the cases of small boats rounding Cape Horn westbound.
 
Good food for thought, PJ. Of course you'd be happiest with a boat that is the fastest and most fun 80% of the time (downwind in 10-15.)

As you know, the best timing is to be doubling the tip of Africa and the Horn in the Austral summer.

Getting downwind fast isn't all reduced displacement. You gotta have increased sail area to match and the means to reduce sail area quickly to preserve your light sails in typical tradewind squalls.

Stan Honey and many others have had great success sailing a Cal-40 to Hawaii. At >16,000 pounds they are not sleds...but downwind they are super. Super Fun. Here's one surfing a wave at "92 knots." https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DzmbjwSO80o

I'm not advocating a Cal-40 for your challenge ....

But maybe time to reinvestigate something like a SC-40, Olson 40, E-37, j-120, Wilderness 40. With a "penalty" pole and spinnaker (>J), you'd have all the horsepower you could wish, and ability to average 180 mi/day downwind in the trades, even with the furniture.
 
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92 knots!!
That's funny!!

Isn't a westward rounding going to be more work? Going into the prevailing wind and seas?
Admittedly I am not well versed in the weather patterns, but most RTW races go eastward with the wind and swell.
 
Round the World westward from San Francisco would take one across the Pacific in the tradewinds (downwind), through the Torres Straits over the top of Aussie, downwind in the SE trades towards Mauritius/Madagascar.

Thence around Cape Agulhas at the tip of Africa northwest (downwind) curving clockwise over the top of the South Atlantic High towards South America. Thence down the coast of South America and around Cape Horn. (in the Southern summer)

From Cape Horn closehauled northwest in favorable Humboldt current into the SE trades, joining the NE trades north of the Equator. Thence close reaching towards the Pacific High, which probably won't be there 'cause it's early spring. With a final board between Hawaii and the mainland towards home. 80% downwind? Could be.

RTW, west to east from France, as is traditionally done, takes one into the westerlies of the Southern Ocean after Africa, downwind in the Roaring 40's across the Indian Ocean and South Pacific. The further south you go, the less miles and more danger. <40 footers discouraged...

My 2 cents. Not sure what PJ is thinking.

A fun exercise for learning world wind patterns is to enter the Virtual Vendee Globe. It's free, but a few extra Euros will get you additional downwind sails and an autopilot that sails to the apparent wind rather than compass. The Virtual Vendee Globe is populated by half a million fanatical Frenchmen, intent on beating the real, at sea, Vendee Globe competitors, winning big cash, and joining on the podium with the heavy hitters. Only takes about 3 months of getting up at night and adjusting your course to the lastest weather forecast/polars. :p Not recommended for relationships.
 
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sleddog said:
My 2 cents. Not sure what PJ is thinking.
Click to expand...

That is my thinking. Looking at windy.tv these trade winds seem pretty well established. Although I will say that most of circumnavigators reading shows that often the prevailing winds deep South are replaced by gales on the nose. There are also plenty of area of variable light air (North of AUS, South of Madagascar, West of South Africa, etc.). That's why I'm thinking a boat that still moves in 2-5 kts of downwind breeze is preferable.

It is to me more important to move at 2 kts instead of 1 kt for 24 hours of 2-5 kts of breeze then to move at 11 instead of 9 in 15-25 kts of breeze. Add reasonable performance close hauled in 30 kts with cross-seas on the nose, a price below 50k, then I've got my boat. Magic!

sleddog said:
Not recommended for relationships.
Click to expand...

Yeah ... now imagine 7 months away at sea ...
 
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