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Emergency Rudders Show-and-Tell

BobJ said:
I don't think so, but we did deploy the kraken and recover it.

For those who weren't there, "the kraken" is my name for a Burke drogue, a well-regarded Australian brand. It came in a nice blue* bag printed with various illustrations, such as using it with a bridle for emergency steering. It worked fine as a drogue but was ineffective as a steering device. The tails of the bridle were led to the primary winches which are well forward on my boat, but this did not provide enough angle to move the stern as each bridle tail was tensioned. This made me realize that unless you have a really wide boat (like a multihull), towing buckets, etc. on either side to steer probably won't work. At a minimum you'd need them on outriggers of some kind.

* This was not the only reason I bought it.
Click to expand...

An improvement that will help drogue steering (note, I'm not saying it will work well, but it will work better) is to lead the drogue bridle forward to the midpoint of the boat. This is typically the widest point and the center of rotation about the keel).

We tested the drogue with Paul before Pac Cup and found one other really important fact. Drogue steering is far more effective the faster you go. Consider motoring even if it just to give a small speed boost when there is wind.

Paul also said our drogue steering was no worse than some of the erudders he had tested. He gave the drogue a minimal passing mark for the inspection and then we installed and SOS rudder before the race start.

The drogue was a Galerider and somewhere on the interweb there is a write up a 40ish footer that removed their rudder and said they could do donuts inside the marina with the drogue because it was so effective. Hard to know how that translates when you test the drogue (or any erudder) with the main rudder still in place. Our J/120 rudder is plenty big and powerful. Not easy to overcome.
 
svShearwater said:
An improvement that will help drogue steering (note, I'm not saying it will work well, but it will work better) is to lead the drogue bridle forward to the midpoint of the boat. This is typically the widest point and the center of rotation about the keel). We tested the drogue with Paul before Pac Cup and found one other really important fact. Drogue steering is far more effective the faster you go. Consider motoring even if it just to give a small speed boost when there is wind. Paul also said our drogue steering was no worse than some of the erudders he had tested. He gave the drogue a minimal passing mark for the inspection and then we installed and SOS rudder before the race start.

The drogue was a Galerider and somewhere on the interweb there is a write up a 40ish footer that removed their rudder and said they could do donuts inside the marina with the drogue because it was so effective. Hard to know how that translates when you test the drogue (or any erudder) with the main rudder still in place. Our J/120 rudder is plenty big and powerful. Not easy to overcome.
Click to expand...

Looking at Greg's last picture, the primaries are indeed well inboard. I'll have to test the kraken again with the tails led to the rails amidships. I have track there where I could put leads, and there's a knee underneath on each side so it can probably stand the load (which is considerable). Removing the rudder might help when using a drogue to steer, since you want the stern to pivot around the keel. This is fairly easy on my boat so I may give that a try as well.
 
svShearwater said:
The drogue was a Galerider and somewhere on the interweb there is a write up a 40ish footer that removed their rudder and said they could do donuts inside the marina with the drogue because it was so effective.
Click to expand...

Yes, I read that as well. It was a Swan 44. Link here:
http://bermudarace.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Steering-without-a-Rudder.pdf
It made me get a galerider for my set up.

I'm embarrassed to say I have yet to test it.
I'm disappointed to say I am out of the LongPac this year for family reasons, so I used this weekend for SHF prep and maintenance instead.
I'll need to try it soon, just not next Saturday, please. :)
 
Just a thought,

My boat has an outboard, which can maneuver the boat independent of the rudder.
( Would this count as e-rudder? Or dq for using power?)
For testing purposes I don't think it would be difficult to remove the rudder, motor out, and test some theories.

If we set up to do this again I will plan to have Nightmare ready.
 
Daydreamer said:
Just a thought,

My boat has an outboard, which can maneuver the boat independent of the rudder.
( Would this count as e-rudder? Or dq for using power?)
For testing purposes I don't think it would be difficult to remove the rudder, motor out, and test some theories.

If we set up to do this again I will plan to have Nightmare ready.
Click to expand...


Did you ever get an answer for this? Never thought about it but you're right and it would work.
 
At a PacCup seminar, a couple skippers who've lost rudders described the experience. Their fin-keeled boats swung uncontrollably through 90-140 degrees unless they were able to slow way down. So I don't think trying to steer the boat with your outboard will help much. If you're 1,000 nm from Hawaii when it happens, there's the fuel issue. The propeller won't stay submerged unless seas are flat. Finally, are you prepared to sit back at the transom and steer with the outboard for hours on end, even if it's calm and you have the fuel? (I realize the Hobie's outboard is mounted inside at the back of the cockpit, but most are hung on the transom.)

Realistically you need a robust emergency rudder, a way to ditch the old rudder if it's jammed off-center and a way to attach a tiller pilot or sheet-to-tiller steering of some sort so you can get some rest.
 
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I don't recall what your boat is, but doesn't it have a full keel with attached rudder? I would take that into account if I was doing your inspection.
Click to expand...

Yeah, it's a full keel with attached rudder. I'm gonna use the windvane as the attachment point for the e-rudder. I figure if I lose use of the existing rudder due to impact with whatever it would be catastrophic. I'm going to have worse things to worry about...like water ingress. Am I wrong? I mean I'm sure there's other scenarios but I'm trying to wrap my mind around how I would jettison my rudder post with a dowel...especially if it is still attached at the bottom of the keel. Anyway, I trust you guys to make the right call.
 
We're talking apples and oranges here, really. Those of us with spade rudders with a shaft coming up into the cockpit inside a tube to a tiller can probably knock the twisted rudder out using a long dowel and hammer (I've done that in the berth when I needed to work on the rudder.) If the tube didn't get cracked by the impact, it's sort of simple. Things get more complicated if normal wheel steering is involved since the rudder shaft comes up into the cockpit, but the rudder tube usually doesn't come thru the hull all the way to the cockpit sole - or in my case above. You'd have to figure out how to seal off the top of the tube inside the hull where the packing gland is. And, I think, remove the quadrant, inside auto helm, etc. Pretty complicated stuff. For a full-keel with attached rudder things get really complicated because, yes, you'd have to figure out how to dive and get the gudgeon and pintles apart at the bottom.
 
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